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Hoffman, Margarite (audio interview #3 of 3)
INTERVIEW DESCRIPTION - This is the last of three interviews with Margarite Hoffman, conducted in living room of her mobile phone in Pomona. Although she was skeptical about the value of her participation in the project, Hoffman was a very willing participant. She was very direct and open in the interview. 6/28/1980
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- 2021-07-26
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- *** File: rrrmhoffman9.mp3 Audio Segments and Topics: (0:07-1:00)... Her husband worked in a shipyard in Wilmington; however, she could not recall what company he worked for. He was employed as an electrician. She does not recall him talking about women who worked in the shipyards. (1:00-3:30)... Security guards were posted at the entrance of the plant and employees were required to show identification in order to enter the plant. Their lunch boxes and bags also were checked by guards before they entered. People were often searched upon exiting the plant if their bags looked suspicious. There also were "lady guards" posted in the women's restrooms to watch out for women who smoked in the restrooms. Hoffman remembers when a woman was sent home because she came to work with green hair. (3:30-6:51)... Although she could not recall the specific wording of sabotage warnings, there were signs that discouraged people from talking about their work outside the plant. In addition to inspectors, security guards, both uniformed and in plain clothes, patrolled the plant overseeing production to inhibit sabotage. There was also a sign in the ladies restroom asking, "Is this trip necessary? Don't take time off of work." The plant had alert warnings in anticipation of an enemy attack and also was equipped with shelters. As the war progressed, the buildings were camouflaged with chicken wire and painted feathers. (6:51-7:52)... When women first went into the plant, the men resented them and refused to help them with their work. As the war progressed, however, and more and more men left the plant for military service, the men who remained in the plant "were pretty glad to have our help." The men teased the women, especially "the younger ones who were quite buxom and wore tight sweaters and tight pants... but they let us old ladies alone." (7:52-8:43)... Hoffman purchased steel-toed shoes at a shoe store in Santa Ana. The company store at Douglas also sold shoes and other types of work attire to employees. (8:43-11:56)... Although Hoffman was recalled to Douglas shortly after she was laid off, the position was filled by the time she returned from her vacation. She went to work at a clothing factory sewing blouses for very little pay. When she heard that Douglas was hiring again around 1950-51, she went to the plant and applied for a position only to be turned away on two occasions. On the third occasion, she was asked to come back for a follow-up interview. She accepted a riveting position even though she had never riveted before and then told her leadman that she was a little "rusty" at riveting. He placed her with another woman who, unbeknownst to him, also did not know how to rivet, so she and Hoffman learned together. (11:56-12:37)... Shortly after Hoffman returned from her vacation, she went to work at a sewing factory because "that was all there was and I wanted to make some money." She was accustomed to making her own money after working at Douglas. When she left Douglas she was earning $1.25 per hour, which was "top wages for women." (12:37-14:57)... When her daughters left home after the war, she and her husband felt a little lonesome without them. It was the first time they had been alone since they married. They had more free time to do things and Hoffman did not have to cook as much. In 1949, they left Santa Ana and rented a home in Fullerton for about six months. They then purchased a home in Santa Ana. During this time, her husband once again found work as a salesman and was offered an opportunity in Whittier. They sold their home in Santa Ana and moved to Whittier in 1949. She lived a relatively easy life compared to what it was during the war. She returned to Douglas in 1951. (14:57-16:46)... Hoffman worked eight hours a day, five days a week in the garment shop. She describes where the shop was located in Santa Ana. To her, it was an oddity to work only five days a week after working six during the war. She spent Saturdays housecleaning and grocery shopping. (16:46-17:36)... Hoffman did not get involved in many activities outside the home in the postwar years. She was more interested in taking care of her home and spending time with her husband. They enjoyed taking drives on Sundays to visit their daughter in Riverside or to the mountains or the beach. They followed the softball leagues in Santa Ana and frequently went to games in the Orange County area. (17:36-19:49)... She worked in the garment shop in Santa Ana for two years before she and her husband moved to Whittier in 1949. Between the years of 1949-51, she stayed home and lived as a typical housewife. She describes the home they rented when they first moved to Whittier. When she heard rumors that Douglas was receiving new contracts and rehiring, she was excited about the prospect of returning to the plant because she enjoyed the work and it was "good money for women." She had no desire to continue sewing or to work as a clerk in a store. Other than those jobs, "there wasn't a lot of things that women could do unless you were trained." (19:49-23:20)... Hoffman describes the interview process when she was rehired at Douglas in 1951. She was assigned to work the swing shift. Although she liked the hours, her husband did not because she was not home to cook for him and he did not like spending time alone in the evenings. After about a year and a half on the swing shift, her husband told her supervisor that she would have to quit if she was not transferred to days. Her transfer came through a week later. (23:20-24:25)... When Hoffman returned to Douglas in 1951, there were quite a few women employed in the plant who had worked there during the war years. She knew some of these women. There were minorities at Douglas in the postwar years and Hoffman worked along side both Mexican and Black women, which whom she got along well. The general attitude towards minorities among the White employees was "Well, it's fine to work with them, but I wouldn't care to go out socially." (24:25-25:48)... Hoffman discusses learning how to rivet when she returned to Douglas. Her leadman believed her when she told him that she was a little rusty at riveting. The pace of production was slow and there was very little riveting work to do compared to the other responsibilities in the department, so she did not feel pressured to learn quickly. She describes the type of riveting work she completed. (25:48-26:58)... She describes how the plant was set up when she returned to Douglas, indicating that she did bench work and the airplane moved from station to station on a track. She did not have to work inside the plane like she did during the war and there were no tall jigs in her department. She was responsible for a specific job in her section. She worked in this capacity for about three years. (26:58-28:11)... Hoffman was out of work for approximately seven weeks during the 1952 strike. Like many people on the swing shift, she believed the strike would be called off by the time her shift ended at midnight. When that did not happen, her leadman packed up their tool boxes and told them not to come to work until they were called back. Usually, when employees walked through the underground tunnel they sounded like geese because their voices echoed off the tunnel walls. On the night of the strike, however, no one said a word. Hoffman did not picket during the strike. End of tape. *** File: rrrmhoffman10.mp3 (0:06-3:56)... Hoffman continues to discuss the 1952 labor strike. Prior to the strike, employees met outside during their lunch hour and discussed the changes they wanted to make to their labor contract. These changes included insurance, better working conditions, and equal rights for women. Hoffman's husband was against the union until he saw how it benefited women. After the a new contract was negotiated, employees were called to a union meeting and asked to vote for the contract. During the strike, some of the supervisors continued to work at the plant. The scabs who worked in the plant were targeted after the strike ended. Although she supported the union, she understood that some people had families to support and could not afford to be out of work. (3:56-7:26)... Hoffman retired from Douglas in 1966 when she was sixty-eight years old. She had planned to retire around the same time as her husband in 1961, but he died suddenly and she decided to continue working to keep herself busy. At the time she retired, she was making doors utilizing a special riveting machine. She describes her job responsibilities, indicating that her job was not a heavy type of work. (7:26-9:54)... During her years at Douglas, she worked in every department in the plant except for machinery. She describes the sections in which she worked and her job responsibilities in those departments. She was transferred into new departments based on production needs. (9:54-12:24)... In 1960, Douglas began hiring inexperienced and untrained Blacks. She was responsible for training a young man who had a difficult time following the production processes she taught him. Although racial problems in society were being exposed in the 1960s, she does not remember witnessing any racial incidents in the plant. (12:24-15:39)... She applied the mechanical skills she developed at Douglas to do repairs an odd jobs around the house. She kept the tool box she purchased when she first started at Douglas and eventually bought a roll away tool box to store the tools she accumulated over the years. She digresses regarding repair work she completed on C-124s and B-17s. These planes came in with "fatigued" metal panels and her crew was responsible for re-paneling the airplanes. She worked under the plane riveting the panels and a male co-worker bucked her rivets. Hoffman speculates that many airplane crashes occur because fatigued and/or stressed metal panels are not properly maintained. (15:39-16:18)... Working at Douglas helped Hoffman develop a new understanding on gender roles within her marriage, stating, "we had a fifty-fifty working relationship." (16:18-18:45)... Hoffman talks about her husband's death and what widowhood meant to her. She returned to work a week after her husband died because she did not want to be home alone. Her co-workers were very supportive when she returned to work. She talks about the women in her crew and provides a photograph of her leadwoman. Union representatives offered their assistance after her husband died. She remembers feeling like a zombie for the first month after he died. (18:45-26:53)... Hoffman got involved in senior citizen activities after she retired from Douglas. She describes her travels with the senior citizen group and provides newspaper clippings and photographs of their luncheon with Mrs. Nixon at the White House. She got involved in the senior citizen meal program, for which she volunteers two days a week. She describes the program and her responsibilities. She also displayed several other documents and photographs: a template she designed at Douglas, and photographs of the plant, including one of her work crew, in which she appears to be younger than the others. (26:53-29:36)... Prior to retirement, Hoffman spent her time outside of work maintaining her household and spending time with her family. She finally learned to drive about a year after her husband died, taking a $100, two-week course. The interview ends just as she is discussing her driving lessons. End of tape. *** File: rrrmhoffman11.mp3 (0:07-2:50)... Hoffman continues to discuss her driving lessons. For the first year of driving, she was nervous and it took her awhile to feel at ease with her driving skills. She drives all over the place now and would be lost if she did not have access to a car. (2:50-4:11)... She talks about why she decided to get involved in senior citizen activities and volunteer for the meal program. (4:11-10:20)... Hoffman moved to Pomona in 1971 to be closer to her oldest daughter. Hoffman purchased a "coach" (mobile home) and decided "if I was going to have a good time, I had to get involved." Her life changed dramatically once she moved to Pomona because of her activities and network of friends, including the "Sew and So Club," a Methodist woman's group that makes clothing for the needy. She also keeps herself busy spending time with a male friend who is a WWII veteran and works as an assistant director of the mobile home community in which she lives. She explains that they are companions and neither wants to remarry. (10:20-12:40)... She talks about her expectations for the future. She would rather go into a convalescent hospital than impose on her family. She would like to stay in her mobile home community as long as possible and hopes to be able to continue driving for many years to come. (12:40-15:38)... Hoffman discusses her family life and how often she visits with her children and grandchildren. She has fourteen grandchildren and fourteen great grandchildren. Whenever a new child is born into the family, she crochets an afghan for the baby. She talks about the lives and careers of some of her children and grandchildren. (15:38-16:44)... Hoffman did not experience any serious menopausal symptoms. She started going through menopause at the age of fifty-four while she was employed at Douglas. She anticipated hot flashes and other symptoms because that is what other women experienced; however, none of these symptoms affected her. (16:44-18:31)... Hoffman reflects back on her life and discusses the happiest, unhappiest, and most fulfilling times in her life. (18:31-20:53)... She discusses her opinions regarding the women's movement and ERA, stating, "I wouldn't fight for equal rights like some of them are. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I still want to be a woman." (20:53-23:24)... Hoffman believes that morals and values have changed dramatically over time and many things are accepted now that would have been scandalous while she was growing up. She discusses her attitudes towards working women, indicating that the root of the problem lies in the fact that women work to pay for the necessities that were considered luxuries in Hoffman's generation. She feels sorry for the children who are placed in nursery schools while their mothers are working. (23:24-24:40)... She talks about what she would do differently in her life if provided the opportunity to do things over. (24:40-26:37)... For Hoffman, working at Douglas "made you more independent and you learned to take care of yourself and you learned to get along with people." She was proud of the fact that she was paid more money than some men employed at Douglas. When she retired, she was earning $3.29 an hour which were "top wages" at that time. End of tape.
- SUBJECT BIO - Marguerite Hoffman had been working as a drape maker for J.C. Penney's before going to work at Douglas Aircraft, Long Beach. Hoffman, the last of three children, was born and raised in Illinois. She attended Normal University for one year, until marrying in 1917. She remained a homemaker until she moved to Los Angeles with her husband and three daughters then years later. Until she began her job at Douglas, she worked outside of the home intermittently or part time, as a drapery maker. She worked as a blouse maker for one year after the war, then was a full-time homemaker until returning to Douglas in 1951. She continued working there until her retirement in 1976. Although Hoffman was skeptical about the importance of her experience, she remained a willing participant throughout the interview process. Because of her busy schedule, the three interviews were strung out over a six week period. The interviews were conducted in the living room of her mobile home in Pomona, where she moved after her husband's death in 1961. Although a private person, Hoffman shared her experiences freely. TOPICS - husband; children; family life; company services; restroom matrons; sabotage warnings; security procedures; camouflaging of plant; men's attitudes towards women in the plant; teasing and flirting; work clothing; po1952 labor strike; retaliation against scabs; job responsibilities; influx of Black workers in the early 1960s; application of mechanical skills at home; panel repairs of C-124s and B-17s; marital relationship; husdriving lessons; senior citizen activities; volunteering; social life; future expectations; family life; children and grandchildren; menopause; reflections on life; attitude towards women's movement, ERA, and worki
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