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Nestor, Barbara (audio interview #5 of 10)
INTERVIEW DESCRIPTION - This fourth interview with Barbara Nestor was conducted in her home in south central Los Angeles. As in previous interviews, she was enthusiastic and energetic throughout the interview. The audio quality of the interview is good, but there are a few interruptions as a result of outside noise, and there is an occasional skip in the recording, particularly in the second half of the interview. 11/28/1974
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- *** File: refbnestor8.mp3 Audio Segments and Topics: (0:00-3:22)... Nestor discusses her experiences living in a socialist commune in Denver, Colorado and her support of the Llano commune. She believes that cooperatives are a useful mechanism for people of like minds to come together and address their needs. There is a natural digression within the interview regarding her impression of the Russian Revolution. She believes that with the exception of the Socialist Labor Party, most socialists supported the revolution. The delegate sent from Denver to Chicago to form the Communist Labor Party turned out to be an agent for the Department of Justice and gave several names to authorities during the Palmer Raids. (3:22-6:19)... There were approximately forty members in the socialist group to which Nestor belonged in Denver, Colorado. Her social and political life meshed at this time and people outside the Socialist Party were aware of her political beliefs. She explains that whenever she met people she spoke to them about socialism because she believed that socialism was the answer. (6:19-10:33)... She describes her vision of a socialist revolution, believing in Marx's view that a revolution would not be a violent action. In the early years of her radicalism, she did believe that a revolution was imminent because the movement was growing. However, the more she observed of the capitalistic system, the less sanguine she became about a revolution. She digresses into a discussion of unionism and the Homestead Strike. (10:33-14:08)... In an attempt to influence those around her, she encouraged people to express themselves through the electoral process. However, she did not think that socialism would be adopted by this means. She also read the Haldeman and Julius Little Blue Books , which explained socialism and capitalism in very simple terms. During this early period, she thought it was very important to educate people; that it was vital to educate workers and develop labor unions, which she saw as the first step in organizing laborers and fighting for change. (14:08-18:40)... Approximately half of the members of her SP group were foreign-born Jews. Her own activities included distributing leaflets in mining towns or wherever workers were engaged in industry. After the digression noted below, she mentions that when she was in Colorado, the German community of Turnhalla was very progressive and the socialists often met there for meetings. There is a digression about her experiences in 1930 distributing leaflets with her daughter, Dorothy Healey, in Pittsburg, California. Despite the large police presence, Nestor distributed all of her leaflets. Dorothy threw her leaflets away to avoid arrest. (18:40-23:25)... With the entrance of Americans into WWI, socialists split into different factions. Nestor's group of forty stayed together in support of the Soviet Union and sanctioned the Communist Party [sic]. Other socialists, particularly the Socialist Labor Party, were anti-Communist and relations with them were often unfriendly. However, she refused to treat these socialists poorly because of their political beliefs. She recounts the discovery that George Inteman, the secretary of the Socialist Party and the delegate sent to Chicago to negotiate the formation of the Communist Party in Colorado, was an agent for the Department of Justice. As a result, approximately eighty people were arrested in Colorado, many of whom were not members of the party, but had attended the founding meeting. Discussing the structure of the Socialist Party in which she was involved, Nestor describes herself as a "Jimmy Higgins," capable of carrying out socialist activities, but never knowledgeable enough to run for a party office. The chronology is broken as she discusses her second husband, Fedya Nestor (also known as Dan), whom she met at a meeting for the American League Against War and Fascism. (23:25-26:15)... She discusses her views on the Russian Revolution. Though confronted with factional disputes during this period, it was not her style to be involved in sectarian struggles and she did not end any friendships because of differing views. She recalls that the Communist Party in Colorado sent funds and supplies to the soviet communities that formed in Seattle, Washington following the Russian Revolution. There were never attempts to form similar communities in Colorado. (26:15-33:30)... Of her group of forty comrades, half were women. She discusses women's roles within the party. Helen Dietrich was the secretary and opened every meeting with a song. She recalls the songs sung by the group, which she believes were an important morale booster and fostered a feeling of solidarity. In general, women with children were restricted in the party in terms of carrying out party activities and holding offices. However, women did have a voice in the party and were probably more outspoken than most women in the rest of society. (She digresses regarding a speaking engagement with the YWCA following her arrest in 1929-30. In Oakland, she also spoke on street corners when asked by the party.) (33:30-38:04)... Although some women in her group had a consciousness of their status in society, most did not think about these issues because if they wanted something they were not restricted. Women who wanted to assume a more active part in the movement were not held back. She recalls that women outside her group were more radical about women's issues, such as Elizabeth Gurley Flynn and Emma Goldman. Nestor discusses her attitudes towards Goldman and how many socialists viewed her. (38:04-43:01)... Initially, the Communist Labor Party encompassed the entire communist movement in Colorado. When the decision was made to form the Communist Party, her group simply changed their name. She discusses her attitudes regarding this change, indicating that many felt the Communist Labor Party was restricted to those active in the labor movement. The Communist Party was formed because people wanted a broader base of members. In general, she felt that the workers were lacking a social understanding. Many people accused her of acting like a bourgeois libertarian because of her Marxist view of the ignorant proletariat. She digresses into a discussion regarding the criticism she received from party members because of her attitudes towards Joseph Stalin in the 1930s. end of tape *** File: refbnestor9.mp3 (0:00-4:15)... The interview begins abruptly with a discussion of her views of the Soviet Union, Leon Trotsky, and Joseph Stalin. She was often criticized for opposing the party line on this and other issues. For instance, she refused to teach a class on self-determination in the Black Belt because many Negro people she met wanted the rights guaranteed in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. (4:15-10:04)... The Communist Party in Colorado was not autonomous and followed the directives handed down from leaders in Chicago and New York. She discusses Will and Helen Dietrich, indicating that Will was known as the "Lenin of Colorado" because he was the link between New York and Colorado. She describes the process involved in transferring from the Socialist Party to the Communist Party (sic) [Note: as discussed earlier, the first step was the formation of the CLP, then the CP.] (10:04-17:24)... Note: there are several skips in the recording in this segment. In this segment, the interviewer clarifies Nestor's involvement with the Socialist Party in Colorado and the party's transition into the Communist Labor Party. Nestor discusses the government agent, Inteman, who was initially a secretary of the Socialist Party and was then elected as a delegate to travel to Chicago and negotiate the formation of the Communist Labor Party. She describes the structure of the party; the initial efforts to organize; and the differences between the Socialist Party and the Communist Labor Party. She believes that the socialists were more adept at organizing and educating people, whereas communists were more dedicated to the idea of changing the world. (17:24-20:10)... Note: there are several skips in the recording in this segment. Nestor describes herself as an outspoken woman who was not afraid to discuss her political views. She recalls a conference at Manual Arts High School in which a comrade confronted a woman from the WCTU regarding the impact of capitalism on alcoholism. Nestor believes that Adolph Hitler gave his soldiers drugs and alcohol so that they would be capable of committing the atrocities with which they are associated. (20:10-24:07)... As a method of organizing people in Colorado, she explained the system of capitalism and its association with unemployment and war. She was successful in recruiting numerous people first to the Socialist Party and then the Communist Party. Although she claims that she was never careful, most people were cautious because of the Palmer Raids and the fear of losing their jobs or of being arrested. As a result, the radical activities during and after the raids lessened to a large extent. (24:07-33:44)... Prior to the ACLU, Christian groups and people such as Jane Addams, Anna Louise Strong, and David Starr Jordan expressed concern over the treatment of radicals during the Red Scare and the Palmer Raids. She recalls that several forums were organized in Colorado in 1919 by liberal Methodists and the Quakers to raise community support for those arrested. Nestor discusses the effects of the Palmer Raids and the Red Scare on the movement and the treatment she received during this period. She was also very active in her children's lives at this time and did not neglect them for her activities. When she moved to California, she often cared for a number of her comrades' children so that they could participate in activities. She explains that there was no formal system of child care in the party. Nestor also took her children with her during some of her activities, and she recalls an incident involving six-year-old Dorothy during a labor strike. (33:44-37:36)... There were very few, if any, discussions in the party regarding the family or women's roles following the Russian Revolution. Most people concerned with these issues were among the intellectual class in the universities. She believes that people generally felt these issues were not a priority at the time. She digresses regarding her attitudes towards the Young Communist League, indicating it was a very clannish group. (37:36-45:16)... After leaving Colorado in 1921, she had very little contact with her former comrades. Occasionally, former friends visited her in California and she describes her experiences with one particular family. She discusses the Hannons and the Dietrichs, noting that Hannon's wife eventually tired of his sexual liaisons and left. Nestor believes that Hannon's interest in her intellectual understanding of the movement was conditioned on his wanting to use her connections with wealthy friends to fund a school. end of tape
- SUBJECT BIO - Barbara Nestor, the mother of Dorothy Healey (former chair, Southern California District, CPUSA), was a radical activist in her own right. Born in Hungary, she was raised first in St. Louis and then in Denver, Colorado. She became a socialist when she was only sixteen, and joined the Socialist Party in 1915. During WWI, she engaged in anti-war agitation. In 1919, when the Communist Party was formed in the US, she joined. After moving to Oakland, California in 1921 with her husband, Joe Rosenblum, and her children, she maintained a high level of activity, particularly with the International Labor Defense, and often risked arrest. She did not re-join the Communist Party until 1936, five years after she moved to Los Angeles. The interviews about the Los Angeles years detail the kind of rank and file organizing in which she engaged. Nestor's oral history sheds light both on her own thinking and on the influence she had on the development of her children's radicalism. Her interviews also reveal a great deal about her relationship with her daughter, Dorothy Healey and her grandson, Richard, for whom she had primary caretaking responsibilities, especially during the 1950s and the Smith Act trials. TOPICS - Topics on this side of the include: Llano Colony; Socialist Party in Denver; socialist ideals and activities; W;W;I; split in SP; gender roles; attitudes towards Elizabeth Gurley Flynn and Emma Goldman; formation of Communist Labor Party; and transition from Communist Labor Party to Communist Party;transition from Socialist Party to Communist Labor Party; attitudes towards Soviet Union, Leon Trotsky, and Joseph Stalin; opposition to party line on self-determination in the Black Belt; government informants; impact of Russian Revolution; Red Scare and Palmer Raids; gender roles; child care; children; and move to California;
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